allyndra: (Chad/Ryan)
allyndra ([personal profile] allyndra) wrote2008-05-05 02:56 pm

Shipping Characters of Color (or not, actually)

So, I've been reading a lot of blogs about race, both in general and in fandom, and I'm trying to become aware of and confront my own skanky race issues. I remember discussion over the fact that people don't ship characters of color as much as white characters. And it drew me up short, because I don't. Chad/Ryan was my first inter-racial OTP, and that's pretty darn recent. All the approval-seeking by Ford never made me want to ship him with John, and even though Ronon is the hottest character ever to grace SGA, I take Rodney over him every time. I do like Gunn (and want him slashed with Xander), but I tend to overlook him. But I could, to some extent, brush this off. Everyone has favorite characters and pairings, and the fact that my pairings tended to exclude characters of color could just be a coincidence.

Then I watched Iron Man. I don't think I'm spoiling anything when I say that Tony Stark (Robert Downey, Jr.) and James Rhodes (Terence Howard) had a close friendship. And lately, I watch everything through slash goggles. Still, despite Tony and Rhodes showing emotional connection, long-term friendship, and a willingness to express affection physically, I didn't have any urge to slash them. And that bothers me. If Rhodes had been played by an attractive white man instead of an attractive person of color, I would probably be frantically searching for the Iron Man slash.

The thing is, if I'm just dismissing interesting, attractive characters out of hand because of their color, how do I fix that? Awareness is usually considered the first step, but what is the second? Should I challenge myself to write more characters of color? Make an extra point of giving fic featuring those characters a chance? I'm going to try both of those, but if anyone has other suggestion, let me know.

Part One

[identity profile] xanzpet.livejournal.com 2008-05-05 11:14 pm (UTC)(link)
This post is very interesting and topical, as I've been considering the same issue of late. I can't speak for your other fandoms, but from a BtVS/AtS point-of-view, there are - sadly - almost no canonical characters of color. From Buffy, I can name Kendra, who appeared in a handful of episodes and was quickly killed off, Mister Trick, and then in Season Seven, there was Potential Rona, Robin Wood, and that freaky one-off demon played by Ashanti. From Angel, we have Gunn and Jasmine, who were African American, and Gavin, who was Asian.

It's a sad state of affairs.

All I can say is that I greatly enjoy Kendra and Gunn and would like to write more of them, but 1) I'm retiring, and 2) there's so much little canonical development of those characters, that it makes them extremely difficult to write. Gunn was a core character for four years, but the audience knows virtually nothing about him, save he'd been fighting demons since he was a teenager, his sister Alonna was turned, and he was once in love with Fred. That's it. After four years. BOO. It's not that I can't write Gunn or that I don't enjoy writing him, it's simply that there are other characters whom I prefer more, and race is irrelevant. I always put him in ensemble pieces because his POV is needed - he's the one who usually cuts through the BS - but it's difficult for me to see him in a romantic light, because I always felt his relationship with Fred was very forced.

Kendra/Xander, FTW! (minus that freaky accent)

So, that leaves us with Jasmine, whom I will never write because her character is inextricably linked with the assassination and later destruction of Cordelia; and frankly, there are better villains in this verse (which is also my reason for negating Trick - lame). Gavin was nothing, though he most likely could work well as a minor player in a fic or a PWP with Lindsey and/or Lilah or something. All that's left is Rona, who I actually really liked. I thought she was cool in that she questioned authority (especially Buffy's) and wanted answers to good questions. She very much reminded me of pre-Finch Faith. I always wanted to write Rona/Xander, not only because I want Xander to be with a Slayer who is neither Buffy nor Faith, but also to contemplate the reactions from other characters toward the relationship.

As for my other fandoms, there are no major black characters on Supernatural; there have been minor ones, but they tend to die quickly. In Harry Potter, I can think of Lee Jordan and Dean Thomas, but no others. Xena had a few memorable characters of color, but as that show was very episodically-driven and Xena/Gabrielle was the ultimate relationship, every character besides them were secondary.

Many cult shows for which the fans build a strong fandom are noticeably lacking characters of color, specifically female characters of color. There are shows which suffer a complete lack, others which produce minor characters of no import, others which produce minor yet memorable characters, and those who have strong secondary/lead characters but don't write them well or explore who they are people. So who's at fault? The writers, for not writing such characters? The producers, for not insisting they do so? The networks, for not demanding a more inclusive cast? Viewers, for not demanding the same thing? Fandom members (including readers, authors, and artists) for not writing those few characters who do exist? I think it's a mixed big.

Part Two

[identity profile] xanzpet.livejournal.com 2008-05-05 11:15 pm (UTC)(link)
Wow, part two! I suck so hard. Sorry! At any rate...

For me, fandom is very personal, and I only write those characters with whom I closely identify. I write Gunn, but not often, because he doesn't mean to me what Cordelia and Xander do. As his character wasn't - in my opinion - well developed, I also don't have much on which to draw in order to write him, as I do with Buffy, Willow, etc., though I much prefer Gunn to them. Of course, the same is also true of Wesley and Fred. I rarely write them because I don't know them. They kind of appeared and filled places I'm not sure needed to be filled, and they were given almost nothing in terms of backstory. Yes, we know a lot about them, particularly Wesley and Fred (insofar as her family, etc.), but do we know who they are? I don't. *shrug*

I'm going to stop here, because I could ramble on for a very long time. I'm also high on cold pills, so if you can't make sense of any of this, I completely understand. :)
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[personal profile] ariadne83 2008-05-06 09:35 am (UTC)(link)
I really struggle with this too. In the recent debate over Ronon & Teal'c's fight scene I made a comment about how the fight itself wasn't racist because Teal'c was from a warrior culture... and then realised this is *exactly* the kind of role black characters get pigeonholed into in the first place *facepalm*
I agree with what was posted above - a lack of development really hinders my ability to connect with a character BUT this does seem to happen more often to non-white characters. So, for me, I'm not dismissing an attractive character *just* because they're black, but because what we're given on-screen is relatively shallow.

Hmm, now that I think about it, maybe consciously creating backstory for some of the COCs would help? For me, it makes me care about them more if I can picture where they came from/what they were like at particular points

I guess all we can do is try

[identity profile] allyndra.livejournal.com 2008-05-06 09:49 am (UTC)(link)
I don't argue that the backstory and development we get for many CoCs is shallow, but so is what we get for a lot of white characters, and they still get written like crazy. Parrish, anyone? He had, what, one scene? And somehow becomes half of an incredibly popular slash pairing? I'm not saying, "Hey, stop writing that Laura Cadman fic, people." But I think I am saying, "Let's write some awesome Peter Grodin fic." Because he was a pretty amazing guy: brilliant, dependable, attractive, and ultimately heroic. So I'm kind of bugged that I've never felt like writing him.

If you (as reigning queen of the plot bunnies) have any prompt ideas for Grodin or Bates or anyone, throw them my way. I want to try and jar myself into writing for characters I've ignored.
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[personal profile] ariadne83 2008-05-07 01:28 am (UTC)(link)
Now that I think about it, I'm Jonesing for some "Grodin at university" fic (I blame Rodney-and-Daniel-at-Oxford from Pegasus B).
Or maybe Bates gets home and as he's struggling to recover from his injuries from and losing his job :,-( he finds his brother has turned into a teenaged brat who doesn't think he's cool anymore

[identity profile] dancinbutterfly.livejournal.com 2008-05-27 09:01 am (UTC)(link)
I dont know man. For me Rhodey/Tony was BEGGING to be written. And when i first got into SGA? Ford/Shep was my OTP. Seriously, it wasnt until...gosh, season 2 that I finally noticed Rodney for Sheppard. Wes/Gunn's been my OTP since forever so...I really dont know. For me its all about chemistry not color.

My Marvel comic ship of ALL TIME? Virgil Hawkins(Static Shock)/Richy Foley(Gear) and in that fandom? its fucking obvious that there's racism. Everyone ships Richy with a white nemesis over his black best friend and confidant. I mean....I just dont get it.
ext_161: girl surrounded by birds in flight. (funvee/humdrumvee)

[identity profile] nextian.livejournal.com 2008-05-27 05:13 pm (UTC)(link)
(Hi, wandered over from [livejournal.com profile] dancinbutterfly's journal.)

I had/have this exact same problem (because I am also a dumb white chick).
If we have this learned behavior (i. e. white boys are the slashy ones), the best thing I can think to do is forcibly unlearn it. What I did was track down canon sources that I already knew (a) were slashy and (b) had more than one major CoC. Reading [livejournal.com profile] deadbrowalking will give you a pretty good sense of places to look, although I wouldn't specifically comment to ask, because they are not an educational resource, just a support group. Psych, for example, is slashy as all crap (in a way that the writers possibly support), and although the main character is coded as white, his actor is Latino; his best friend is black. I had to find new canon to do this in -- I'll probably never ship John/Ronon, because I'm too used to watching for John/Rodney. I don't know if this applies to everyone, or just to me because I am a douche.

The other thing you have to get used to is a lack of fandom support -- Shawn/Gus, the pairing in question on Psych, has maybe five stories written about it, and as you point out, nobody writes Tony/Rhodes right now. Find someone you know doesn't have this problem, and squee your ears off with them instead of with the larger internet, because the larger internet will not be any help.

OKAY I'm sorry I left you a complete comment of spam! But this post is really kind of awesome to see, because any sort of awareness of the issue is, er, a little rare right now. /relurk